[SUBMISSION] Shinobi

I'm sorry, but the sprites have to change. There's nothing sneaky about the Baron of Hell or Hell Knight. These are depicted as tanks. They're slow and take a lot of punishment before going down. What you have there is the complete opposite of what those guys are.

Fine. I will change them - but you're killing my dreams here. Just outright killin' them. Anyhow, the idea is that they are the same species of demon, but while Knights and Barons are trained for war, these guys are, instead, trained as asassains. I might go for something resembling an archvile instead though - but they lack a physical attack animation, which is a huge problem. The Revenant already has a lot of dark colored variants - like Death Incarnate. I might take a look at re-purposing the Hierophant sprites, but maybe with a head like a lost soul. Or just a re-color, or both. And, if it's too big, I might have to shrink it. Does anyone know of an archvile variant w. a physical attack, that would really be best. And if not, are there any spriters interested in making one? I really need him to resemble a greater demon, rather than an imp or something. Because, in terms of lore and such, he IS a greater demon, and an imp sprite just won't cut it.

I'd like to point this out real quick, which I should have done before but oh well. This monster has a backstory and some lore behind it, which is fine. I do a little bit of that as well with some of my creations. However, it is important to keep in mind that when submitting something to this site the lore and backstory for one's submissions will more than likely not be taken into consideration in the overall design. If you are creating your own mod with a story and lore of its own that this monster fits in with, that's fine. But when submitting to this site you need to keep in mind that people from all over will be able to take that monster and use it for their own ideas, regardless of your intended use. This site is for mod authors to come in and download other creations to put in their stories, their mods, and change them how they see fit for their own projects.

So when creating a monster do not let your own personal lore for a monster you are creating get in the way of making chances based on other people's feedback. We are not here to 'kill your dreams' nor are we here to point out flaws in your creations for the sake of putting you down. Feedback is critical for any product and is intended to help you, not hurt you. Feedback shouldn't be taken personally.


And, to thrown my two cents in here as well and give my own feedback, I do agree with BlueShadow. Lore aside, the visuals simply don't match the style of monster you are going for. When creating something fast and stealthy one doesn't normally think of a big muscular hunk of a character. That kind of body figure fits more with slower heavy hitters. So the concept and the visual aspect is confused in this sense. You can still have a smaller and faster enemy that can deal a large amount of damage.

Additionally, you do not need to keep within the Doom style monster set either. I'd recommend looking towards using something more along the lines of Hexen style since there are plenty of humanoid figured that would better come across as stealth fast builds. For example, my Shadow Hunter could be used for something like this. It is small, covered in dark clothing, and would fit much better conceptual wise. There are many other kinds of sprites like this as well that would fit better.

Okay - firstly, the "killin mah dreams" was me being funny. There was a silly voice involved... maybe you can't hear it...

I actually come here everyday in the hope of seeing feedback - i want this guy to be great, and I want him to end up in the Repository - and I try to take into consideration what people say. I agreed to change sprites - and thus they will be changed. I liked it before, but I really don't mind that much. Also remember that I took MOST of MagicWazzards suggestions - because I want this to be a nifty new monster on the Repository. I think he has a cool backstory and idea, I'd love to see him get used in a cool mod.

I have actually considered a Heretic type skin - Hexen is the sequel, but they pretty similar. I would prefer the Archvile, but its unlikely to happen. I might actually make it a Revenant type skin anyways, tbh - a skeleton IS liable to be easily destroyed. While I'm at it, maybe I'll think of a new name related to his new skin - another title, such a Shinobi, but maybe a bit more medieval rather than feudal japan, because inconsistency. Instead of making it black, maybe I will make him have dark red bones and black energy/fire round his fists when he punches. I think that could work well - I could call him a Black Hand. Thoughts?

Yes, a revenant is more fitting, I'd say.

skelepound wrote: Okay - firstly, the "killin mah dreams" was me being funny. There was a silly voice involved... maybe you can't hear it...

Subtlety is a delicate artform online. Don't hesitate to be liberal with the smilies when in doubt!

skelepound wrote: I might actually make it a Revenant type skin anyways, tbh - a skeleton IS liable to be easily destroyed. While I'm at it, maybe I'll think of a new name related to his new skin - another title, such a Shinobi, but maybe a bit more medieval rather than feudal japan, because inconsistency. Instead of making it black, maybe I will make him have dark red bones and black energy/fire round his fists when he punches. I think that could work well - I could call him a Black Hand. Thoughts?

How about Heretic's Undead Warrior? (The skeleton knight dude.) I know he's seen a lot of edits on the ZDoom forums, so perhaps there's one with a sword instead of an axe that fits the concept. (The Death Knight edit is probably a bit too much, though.) The Guardian from Shadow Warrior could maybe work, perhaps with a bit of tinkering, though that may be a more controversial choice.

Well, as the master of the Tint feature in SLADE(lol), I found that 24% red on the sprite for Death Incarnate makes him look like he has bare, red muscle and flesh with yellow white bones poking through. Its a REALLY neat effect. Death Knight you say? I'll see about it, he might have something cool. I am a fan of Heretic. Any other complaints, or is it only the graphics keeping me from getting commit- i mean submitted.

I am not that smart in question about what type your monster should be. Should it be Baron, Demon, Revenant or some other. Sure I am not sure if my opinion is necessary for you to pass but I have some thoughts.

Your monster is not very difficult to beat in regular room but he seems to be full of dark energy. He is very fast and powerful and those kind of enemies are sure very cool to watch from movies. From here you for example could make a trail effect to make his speed reasonable and add transparency for making him scary and difficult in dark areas.
My critizism would be that you don't need to make him to attack twice to make him fast. He is a melee type and fast so he would be that fast anyways, For now it is not very reasonable to see him attacking for no reason once more if dodging him. Instead you may make it jump back to the target if he is kicked away during his attack. :cool:

Maybe, when he dies it would be nice when he explodes with some kind of ice effect so after that the parts of his body would disappear slowly for example. :roll:

Well, the double attack is a leftover from the Satyr code. I've not had complaints so far, but i may change it. I dnk how tho. His sprite will be a Revenant re-skin, in all likelihood, the ones you see are a placeholder. Transparency and trails, I already ruled out, it will not really fit the new sprite,among other things. Your ideas are cool - but not what I had in mind for his guy. The double attack, though, I will look into that.

Just wanted to check in to see if there was an update to the monster regarding feedback already mentioned.